Air Vice-Marshall Ernest Adeleye is an elder statesman and a former military governor of Rivers State. He is also a leader of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and forms part of the party’s leadership in Ekiti State. He speaks on various national and sundry issues in this interview with select journalists. SAM NWAOKO brings the excerpts:
Insecurity is the issue in the country today. As a retired general, what would you say when you look at the security situation in the country, as regards the insurgency in the North-Eastern part of the country?
Insurgency is not new to any part of the world and it is not a situation you can arrest in one month, two months and so on. The situation we found ourselves in our country is that we are not actually on a united route with our people and government is now making efforts to make sure that everything is in order. if you recollect, Osama bin Laden was sought for many years before Obama was able track him down. Insurgency is in every part of the world and we do not expect our government to end this issue in an immediate form because it did not start now. I think it started in 2002 or even before but people did not notice. So the way the government is tackling it is the best way any reasonable government would tackle the issue. You will recollect that some people talked about ammunition, weapons and so on and so forth. We don’t manufacture the weapons; we only have people who know how to use the weapons or machinery for warfare. Don’t forget too that our economy would depend on the kind of equipment we can afford and insurgents are within and without and our people in the North-East are part of the system there. If you remember, in Yobe, there was local government election that went on smoothly but there is also insurgency in Yobe. You have councillors there; you have members of the House of Assembly there. People in the House of Representatives are there and there are also those in the Senate. All of them have to work together to sort out this insurgency. It is not only the military. The military cannot do it alone. For instance, in this town, they are attacking from Odo Ori; some might decide to attack from Iyin, and from Ilawe at the same time. Kill and go.
However, the one that intrigues me and makes me very unhappy is that people who had worked in government (ministers, senators and so on) use foul language on the problem. They come out to say unholy things about government, as if they hadn’t been part of the system. They can make their voice heard but it is not by castigating the government where you had served. If things go wrong, you have a way of going to government with suggestions. If there is anyone of them who knows better, let them tell government. You have people who had served in the highest places in this country and when they talk sometimes, it is very irritating as if we are not Nigerians.
Are you saying that the way the government is handling the insurgency is okay?
Yes, because I haven’t seen anyone with a better idea on how to go about it. If there is, let the person speak up. These people don’t sleep. Is there anybody who would like to see his town run over by insurgents and they are happy? Probably some, due to political reasons, don’t care.
If you say the way it is being handled is okay, what about the allegations of lack of capacity of the military and the talk of their not being well equipped to confront the problem?
The issue is that insurgency is not a conventional warfare. Nigeria will plan and say ‘okay for 2015, this is the budget for Ministry of Defence and the Police.’ Then something else comes from a different angle. The amount you have budgeted for the Ministry of Defence cannot resolve five per cent of the problems insurgency has caused. You will need new equipment; you will need new training and training facilities and a lot of sensitisation and reorientation of the people.
I have not seen a country where insurgency was defeated easily. The only bad part of it is just our (Chibok) girls. We have heard of some local government areas captured and so on and so forth. But we still have people who are living there and there are members of the state assemblies and local government officials, etc. in these places and they are there. You need new equipment and attitude to counter what is happening and government will have to source for it and other areas of government will suffer.
Can you blame what is going on on political sabotage?
I think it is part of the problem. In my opinion, it is part of the problem, because a credible opposition will, at least see something good in the government. It is not all bad and when it comes to security, all of them will have to work together. They will have to sit down together. Don’t politicise insurgency. This is wrong. If it does not affect you today, you don’t know what may happen tomorrow.
Politicisation of this insurgency will do us no good. People may deny that it is not being politicised but we all know. If election holds in those places today, they would provide councillors, members of the Assembly, House of Representatives people and senators.
Coming back to local politics, you are a member of the committee that worked towards the creation of Ekiti State. With the creation of the state, are you happy about the status of the state today in terms of development?
Sadly, when we started this Ekiti State issue, it was with enthusiasm. I came with other well-meaning Nigerians… I had said after 35 years in service, I wasn’t going to work for any government again. But when the issue of Ekiti State came, I had to swallow my pride and said okay whoever is in government we will have to work with him. Starting from (Colonel Inuwa) Bawa, he made me the chairman of Ekiti State Development Fund. While I was the chairman, I told the governor that I will only take the job if he didn’t give instructions that they should come and take out of the money. He said it was okay by him, that it was our state and that we should go and run it the way we wanted. The money was about N30 million at that time and then we made sure that we accounted for every penny. After a year in service I tendered the account of all the things we did. We made sure we brought the company that produced coal tar back to Ekiti and that was the time we were able to tar the roads in Ado Ekiti. We gave them N7 millin to start. We built the roundabouts in Ado Ekiti but it is unfortunate that those roundabouts are an eyesore now. When you come to Ekiti and compare what is happening in other states, you shed tears. I read of a senator that built 40 boreholes for his district, among other things, and I wondered how many our senators have collectively brought back. It is unfortunate. So, I’m not happy because if you go to other state capitals, we will be sorry for ourselves.
Are there prospects of this changing now that you have a new government; this government is believed to be your government?
I know this new man. I knew him before. I wouldn’t know who would tell him anytime I came home, because he would drive here and say ‘please, let us go and visit one of our project sites’ and when you follow him you will see what he is doing. If you are confident about yourself and what you are doing and you want your citizens who are not living in Ekiti to know what you are doing and you’ve seen that those things are rightly done, you have to give him credit. So, God helping him and helping us, there will be changes in the position of things in Ekiti.
There are so many things we read in the newspapers and saw on the television that we had done but on getting home here, there were no such things. It was governance of mass media; governance of radio and TV and one is not too happy about that. People give you information and it is from them that you learn what is going on. We learnt that he has paid salary but, unfortunately, he has no money. If anybody denies the fact that we owe tremendous amount of money, let the fellow think twice. I fear for the governor because of how he will pay the amount that we are owed.
The figure of the debt owed by Ekiti State is controversial. Will you as a person want the EFCC and ICPC to be invited to probe the past administration or would you prefer an independent audit of the various figures quoted by the past and present governments so as to ascertain the truth?
The basic truth is that we are owing heavily, whether it is N25 billion or N85 billion. But if you owe, have you got things to show for it and how to get money to pay back? That is the issue. Whether it is N25billion or N85 billion, we are owing more than the state can accommodate. The probe depends on the government and the Ekiti people. We should not come around to say this government has not done this or that when the government has so much to pay. It is the people that should say we want a probe or not. If they check all the work done by the past administration and they are fair, it is okay. But if it is not and that they have to pay for the same projects twice, then the government has to sit down. One thing I know is that the money we are owing is out of proportion whether it is N25 billion or N85 billion.
If you were the governor, what would you do?
If I were the governor, unfortunately, I wouldn’t be a governor again because I forgot nothing in the government house. So, I don’t have a way of thinking of what I am going to do now. But you leave it to the young guys. It is not difficult to know in this computer age. You look at it and see what they have said they had done and compare.
If you are to set agenda for Governor Ayo Fayose, which area would you want him to concentrate on?
Infrastructure and agriculture are the areas. Let the people be able to eat. Let them be happy. Since Oni left, I’ve not had water in my house. Fayose was always carrying water in tankers if you recall. We have Ero dam there; what have we done? He has to provide water for the people and concentrate on agriculture. He has to invite people to come and do things here because he cannot do it alone. Then all our people in the National Assembly should use their constituency allowance for their people. I have not seen any development from the people there in both the Senate and the House of Representatives. I don’t have an insight into what they are paid as allowances but I am judging from the ones I read in the newspapers from Kano, Katsina and so on. You may say we don’t get the same amount from the government but the senators have the same allowance. House of Representatives members also have the same allowance. We as a people must also try to help Ekiti in any position we are. So, my advice to the governor is that in any position in the next election, they should be able to select people who would be able to talk to them in the Federal Government. They should select people who would be able to bring things home from the Federal Government. If a senator puts even 20 boreholes, will the governor and the people not be happy? If the Reps also bring 10 boreholes and scatter them in the constituency, it will help the government. So we should think ahead about the people we are going to sent into political appointments next time.
President Goodluck Jonathan said he had not done anything for Ekiti and promised that he would change if the state is being governed by a PDP government. Do you think that was good for the state?
I didn’t hear him say that and I wasn’t there to know if he had been quoted out of context. But I have said that all of us must be able to put ourselves in positions where we must be able to help ourselves.
How many presidents have visited Ekiti to commission a project? If you don’t tell them what you want and are so arrogant (excuse the language) and make yourself inaccessible to people, this becomes difficult. The people in Abuja are human beings. You can go to them and say ‘excuse me sir we don’t have electricity’ or we want facilities at Federal University, Oye or we need some things in the Ministry of Agriculture. That is what this governor can do. They would say that the other man had also come and from there, you get things done. We Ekiti people must help ourselves.
2015 is coming and we are in the heat of the selection of those who would represent the state at various offices, with attendant problems. Don’t you see this as part of the problems the state government would face in the near future?
In a democratic dispensation, such squabbles would always arise. You remember 27 people wanted to be governor in Ekiti. Some don’t understand computer, some could do this or that but out of the lot you will have to arrive at one. If there are squabbles now, the governor should now sit down and remember I did mention that the people to represent us must be people of near impeccable character to be able to deliver. When we have such people, we would be able to help ourselves.
Selecting people for a position is not an easy thing to do in a democratic set up. It involves a lot of give and take and luckily for us, all the people vying for position are educated enough and if here are squabbles, then it’s a thing they could iron out at the party level.
What is your advice to Ekiti people and Nigerians considering the current political dispensation?
Ekiti has been neglected in the past in the scheme of things and they should now use this opportunity of Fayose’s government to help us develop. There are federal ministries of Agriculture, Water Resources, Aviation, Health and so on. We want federal presence here and when we have that, there is the chance of more of our people getting employed. There is nothing wrong in the Federal Government establishing a fertilizer plant or a mini refinery here. Why not? The Federal Government should come to our aide this time. First of all, they should assist Fayose to get out of the financial problem that has been unleashed on him because if people are not paid their salaries, that is when trouble starts. He has managed to pay October salary on time and I am surprised. The other ones, I understand that there are arrears are still there. We are in a real difficult situation and I don’t know how many hours of sleep he would get in a day. When I was a governor, I didn’t have this type of problem and I was unable to sleep. So I don’t know what would happen to this man who has a financial problem.
What is in Ekiti that we will say we are really happy about? Fayose is just making a new beginning. Generation of employment will be better off if the Federal Government brings more of its presence here in the state.
Credit: Tribune